Liveblogging the Caplis and Silverman Show on S2

Because blogger was down, I had to move over to squarestate.net.

I will post the end result here but please participate over there.

Caplis and Silverman is commonly compared to Fox's Hannity and Colmes. We'll see what happens.


FROM SQUARESTATE:
I will be blogging the debate between Crystal Clinkenbeard of No on 48 and Dan Caplis and Kristi Burton.

Please refresh your browser every couple of minutes and don't forget to look below the fold.

Its Crystal versus the others on this because Caplis was a Democrat before he became a Republican. The reason he became a Republican is because of the "life" issue. I think we know what to expect from Colorado's version of Hannity and Colmes.

Please donate to the campaign.
Follow us on twitter
Myspace is where you can find us too or go to our site or our blog.

I'm sooo excited n stuff.

...not

You can listen online here
3:07 "Kristi Burton, one of the most impressive people" ... I think we know where this is headed.

"she has conducted herself well." no, not really.

3:24 sorry, its just been commercials, commercials, commercials.


3:44 this is torture. The debate has yet to start.

4:03 While we are waiting, I see that there is a call to No on 48 supporters to organize in the final days before the election. Please check out the schedule of events at Protect Families, Protect Choice.

Any minute now...

HERE WE GO!

4:07 Caplis "Kristi can be whatever she wants.. czar of teh universe if she wants... I have a deep bias on this,".. he is very anti-choice.


Kristi lied about where her law school is. Its an online law school, not in California. Be honest Kristi, you have to denounce science to go there. You don't get to use "science" to defend your sneaky amendment to outlaw abortion.

Crystal Clinkenbeard "48 does nothing to dissolve the social issues around abortion... there is no medical or scientific consensus about when a human life begins... there are many groups against amendment 48..."

Caplis goes on the attack: "Do you believe that legal protection should apply at the moment life begins? I think you get most of your Planned Parenthood.. PP makes millions and millions and millions of dollars killing babies."

FACT: Federal and state law prevent ANY funds from going to abortion services. PP makes sure women have the tools to empower themselves about their human and reproductive rights. PP is a non-profit that has to invest the money it makes back into providing the services it provides, it is not a for-profit company.

4:23 Silverman is talking about Kristi's shoe size.

4:27 Burton "we (science) know today what we didn't know 30 years ago (roe v wade)... science is "conclusive" about when life begins."

That is patently not true.

Silverman is making horrible arguments, not related to the effects of 48. I write in disbelief. The dinosaur medium in its final throes.

Kristi in regard to the catholics who are against this: "the archdiocese has not taken a stance on this." This is not true:

Colorado’s Catholic bishops do not support
this amendment because of problems with its strategy outlined previously through the
Colorado Catholic Conference.

KB cites MLK jr. as being in support of 48. hmmm...

Caplis is calling medical opinion, "opinion".. like that somehow negates it.

LOL Caplis is calling PP extremists! LOL

4:48 This is exceedingly difficult to make heads or tails of. Kristi Burton and the hosts are attacking Crystal and won't let her answer the way she sees fit. How can you make your point when the cards are stacked against you?

Here are some stats on when PPRM will perform an abortion for choice: PPRM will perform them up until 17 weeks, 6 days at one location in Colo Spgs. Dr. Hearn will perform abortions for choice up until 25 weeks, he will do them until pregnancy is done in cases to protect the woman's health or for developmental anomalies.

Here is a great source of info about what Caplis is really about, how he is biased, how he is extreme.

Silverman is really of no help either. He he demonstrates minimal understanding of this basic human rights issue.

Overall, the bias expressed against the opponents of 48 was not unexpected. Anyone who knows anything about Caplis and Silverman knows that they are the Hannity and Colmes of Colorado talk radio. I commend Crystal for her strength and stamina in the face of an opposing force who gets to control the conversation.

The Overwhelming Majority of Scientists Say NO to 48

Everyday there is something new that the proponents of Amendment 48 twist and lie about. Yesterday there was a radical radio show featuring Kristi Burton from the pro-48 campaign in which the hosts ranted on about “the left” worshiping Hitler, Stalin and how the left "likes killing babies and old people." Its inflammatory talk like that can incite people to violence. If those who are pro-48 were dedicated to espousing the truth and against killing, Kristi would have corrected the hosts, instead she agreed. That goes too far.

Today a press release from Colorado for Equal Rights was broadcast claiming doctors are in support of Amendment 48. In it Kathleen Klotz Puls, M.D. says that the Colorado Medical Society says vote NO on 48 but she disagrees with them.

Also from the release, Dr Sam Alexander, a supporter of 48 unwittingly says “but we can't establish truths based upon what consequences we desire” when in reality, this amendment is the epitome of a culturally biased desire; a sneaky way to sweepingly outlaw abortion.

To include a fertilized egg in the definition of a person is not a definition that is legally or scientifically feasible, it is a definition that is culturally and religiously relative.

Kristi Burton:

It is time for Colorado citizens to realize that many, many physicians are on the side of science and technology

I agree Kristi. Many doctors are on the side of science and technology which is why they are against the amendment. Just take a look at the list below.

Please donate to the No on 48 campaign.

The following list can be found here

The Colorado Medical Society says vote no.

The Colorado Gynecological-Obstetrical Society says to vote no.

And here are the other medical, legal, familial, and community organizations who say vote “no” on 48.


· 9to5 National Association of Working Women

· ACLU of Colorado

· American Association of University Women of Colorado

· American College of Nurses and Midwives Region V, Chapter III

· American Fertility Association

· American Society for Reproductive Medicine

· Americans for Cures

· Anti-Defamation League Mountain States Region

· Arapahoe County Democrats

· Association of Professional Women

· Boulder Abortion Clinic

· The Bell Policy Center

· Boulder County Democrats

· Boulder Valley Women’s Health Center

· Broomfield County Democrats

· Center for Reproductive Rights

· Citizens Project

· Coalition for the Advancement of Medical Research

· Colorado Academy of Family Physicians

· Colorado Anti-Violence Program

· Colorado Bar Association

· Colorado Coalition for Girls

· Colorado Coalition Against Sexual Assault

· Colorado Federation of Business and Professional Women

· Colorado Gynecological-Obstetrical Society

· Colorado Libertarian Party

· Colorado Medical Society- Council on Legislation

· Colorado NOW

· Colorado Organization for Latina Opportunity and Reproductive Rights (COLOR)

· Colorado Organization on Adolescent Pregnancy, Parenting and Prevention

· Colorado Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice

· Colorado Society of Osteopathic Medicine

· Colorado Women’s Agenda

· Colorado Women’s Bar Association

· Compassion and Choices, Colorado Chapter

· CREDO Mobile/ Working Assets

· Democratic Women of Boulder County

· Democratic Women's Club of El Paso County

· Denver Chapter, Certified Nurse-Midwives

· Denver City Council

· Denver Democratic Party

· Denver Democrats—HD 7A & 7B

· Denver Women's Commission

· Denver Young Democrats

· Douglas County Democratic Party

· Eagle County Democrats

· El Paso Democratic Party

· Equal Rights Colorado

· The Freedom Fund

· Feminist Majority Foundation

· Four Corners OB-GYN

· Gilpin County Democrats

· Hadassah, Colorado Chapter

· Indigenous Youth Sovereignty Project

· Interfaith Alliance of Colorado

· Jefferson County Young Democrats

· Jefferson County Democrats

· Jewish Community Relations Council

· La Plata County Young Democrats

· La Plata Medical Society

· Lambda Community Center

· Larimer County Democrats

· Law Students for Reproductive Justice – University of Denver Chapter

· League of Women Voters of Colorado

· Legal Momentum

· LUZ Reproductive Justice Think Tank

· Metro State Feminist Alliance

· NARAL Pro-Choice Colorado

· NARAL Pro-Choice America

· National Abortion Federation

· National Advocates for Pregnant Women

· National Association of Social Workers, Colorado Chapter

· National Council of Jewish Women, Colorado Section

· National Latina Institute for Reproductive Health

· National Organization for Women (NOW)

· New Era Colorado

· Northern Colorado AIDS Project

· Peak Area Gender Expressions

· Physicians for Reproductive Choice and Health

· Pikes Peak Pride Center

· Planned Parenthood of the Rocky Mountains

· ProgressNow

· Republican Majority for Choice

· RESOLVE: The National Infertility Association

· Sexual Assault Services Organization

· Society for Assisted Reproductive Technology

· Square State

· Weld County Democrats

· The White House Project

· The United Court of the Pikes Peak Empire

· Women's Foundation of Colorado

· Women’s International League for Peace and Freedom

· Women’s Lobby of Colorado

· Women’s Resource Center of Durango



Individuals

* Colorado Governor Bill Ritter
* State Senator Betty Boyd
* State Senator Dan Gibbs
* State Senator Bob Hagedorn
* State Senator Moe Keller
* State Senator John Morse
* State Senator Chris Romer
* State Senator Nancy Spence
* State Senator Sue Windels
* State Representative Alice Borodkin
* State Representative Terrance Carroll
* State Representative Mark Ferrandino
* State Representative Randy Fischer
* State Representative Sara Gagliardi
* State Representative Gwyn Green
* State Representative Mary Hodge
* State Representative Cheri Jahn
* State Representative Joel Judd
* State Representative John Kefalas
* State Representative Andy Kerr
* State Representative Claire Levy
* State Representative Alice Madden
* State Representative Anne McGihon
* State Representative Joe Rice
* Former State Senator Dottie Wham
* Former Colorado Supreme Court Justice Jean Dubofsky

* Betsy Markey, Candidate - 4th Congressional District
* Evie Hudak, Candidate - State Senate District 19
* Joelle Riddle - La Plata County Commissioner

Desperate Attempts

The proponents of Amendment 48 sent an op-ed to their mailing list. In it they ask a few questions and offer some incomplete answers. You can find the full text here.

A question from the proponents of 48 campaign:

The Personhood Amendment defines person in the state constitution as beginning at the moment of conception. If it's true that human life begins at conception, is there any way acknowledging that truth can 'go too far'?

A. Yes, their amendment goes too far.

Without laying out the effects of their amendment, the proponents deceive voters of their true intent to illegalize all forms of birth control. It is no secret that they are back at it again, trying to undermine women’s struggles to gain equality and control over their persons by getting into your bedroom. By including eggs from the moment of fertilization as legal persons in their amendment, the effect is an all-out and sweeping attack on women’s rights.

Their amendment goes too far. It is shifty and deceitful.

More from the email:

If the (opponents of 48) simply pick up any dictionary and look up 'person', they will find the definition: 'A human being.' That's what it's meant for the last several centuries.

This is simply not true. The legal definition of person is here. It is easy to see why legal definitions are appropriate to law, scientific definitions are appropriate to science and cultural definitions are applicable only to a culture. There is a lot of overlap but in cases of morality, such as is the argument the proponents make, science is not appropriate to refer to for moral guidance and legal nuances are not scientifically measurable. Amendment 48 is a subjective moral definition in law.

Everyone I have spoken with about the effects 48 would have goes round and round with infinite scenarios of varying severity. This amendment brings up too many unanswered questions to which the proponents refuse to answer.

Remember your rights.

Vote no on 48

Full Text Email

Here is the full text of the email sent out by Amendment 48:

"Amendment 48 -- It simply goes too far." It's the mantra of the opponents of the Personhood Amendment. Dottie Lamm and Linda Campbell, for example, use it in an editorial printed in several newspapers across the state. It's been repeated until you're probably hearing it in your sleep, but does it mean anything? Resorting to repetitive use of a meaningless phrase is a propaganda tactic commonly employed when there is no substance to an argument. Opponents of 48 are hoping for what psychologists call a 'conditioned response'. You step into the voting booth and when you see Amendment 48 that little phrase automatically jumps into your head and you vote no. But before you vote, ask yourself this: Is the phrase true?

The Personhood Amendment defines person in the state constitution as beginning at the moment of conception. If it's true that human life begins at conception, is there any way acknowledging that truth can 'go too far'?

It has been interesting to watch the strategy of the 'no on 48' campaign. They know if they attempt to contend human life doesn't begin at conception they're arguing with virtually every geneticist and embryology textbook available. So instead, they take issue with the dictionary. They concede that human life begins at conception, but claim 'personhood' doesn't begin until some later, yet to be determined, date. They never come out and say it, but they assume it's okay to 'terminate' a developing 'human' until he or she reaches that undefined point of 'personhood'. If they simply pick up any dictionary and look up 'person', they will find the definition: 'A human being.' That's what it's meant for the last several centuries. 'Person' and 'human being' have always been the same thing, but the 'no on 48' folks plan to change all that. And, they do it as though no one should even question their totally illogical and false premise. They simply assume it's true and expect you to do the same.

Liveblogging the Conference Call with Proponents of Amendment 48

7:00 Open with prayer

7:08 Kristi states that the No on 48 campaign won't recognize when a person gets legal rights. For the record: people get voting rights when they are 18, they get other rights when they are 16, Social Security at various times in life, many rights upon birth, etc. Not everyone has equal rights all the time.

Kristi tries to put down the No on 48 campaign. She complains that financial reports show that Planned Parenthood, who works to reduce abortions by empowering people, is the campaign's biggest financial backer. Then she struggles to slander the campaign by claiming No on 48 tries to hide our financial records but of course, its all online. You can see that we aren't hiding anything. She is completely making stuff up.

7:13 Four major donors to the proponents of 48 are individuals? I will have to report on that after the call. I can guess that they have a history.

7:20 Woman claims that she is shocked that Colorado's anti-abortion community only now took on abortion with 48 when in fact they targeted CO because of the low requirements we have to get something on our ballot. which is why we have such a crowded ballot.

7:26 They mention Amendment2 (LOL) from 1992 which in Colorado prevented equal rights for gays. The proponents are "encouraged by the Colorado passing" of this radical amendment that was eventually overturned because of its unconstitutionality. It is well documented that the reason this passed was because of its confusing language. The proponents preyed on keeping people ignorant-- that is there only strategy??? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romer_v._Evans

7:34 Eduardo who is one of the featured speakers just apologized for interrupting??? I dont get it. Eduardo just got back from campaigning for John McCain who they think is pro-life. For the record: John McCain is not pro-life. Eduardo "if you arent' willing ot die for a cause, life is not worth living." OMG

Eduardo from "Bella"

7:41 "The teevee ads are teh most effective tool." If by tool they mean it in a derogatory sense, then yes, their ads are "tools".

And you can see them in my post below as well.

7:45 Another prayer about how much money they need to fulfill their unholy mission.

7:55 Final recommendations from their listeners to make this pass: pray to God for His blessing.

Kristi's final word: "I would just like to thank everyone... I had an idea that God has laid on my heart... God is with us."

8:01 Closing prayer

This was overall a boring call. Simply a commercial punctuated by falsehoods typically perpetrated by such an extreme group. I will post more evidence against their claims here and at coloradopols.com and squarestate.net. Please follow us on twitter and sign up for email updates and other info at protectfamiliesprotectchoice.com.

I will post a recording of the commercial tomorrow here so you can hear for yourself.

You can donate to stop this sneaky amendment at our actblue page.

Thanks for your support and let's go beat this thing!

Update 10/16 Here is the recording.

New Commercials from Both Sides Scream NO on 48

Released today are commercials from both sides of Amendment 48.

First, from No On 48:




And now from those who want you to think that an amendment to the Colorado Constitution "won't change the Constitution," we have a fireman scolding a nurse for putting both of their lives at risk:


The Fire from Personhood USA on Vimeo.
The Scarecrow from HELL! on Vimeo.



DNA? from Personhood USA on Vimeo.

The last three are mocking the intelligence of Coloradoans. Exactly how much money did they spend on these weird blunders?

Dont be a redneck who can't tell the difference between a scarecrow/joke/Blair Witch and a person. Vote No on 48.

Articles on the dangers of Amendment 48

Denver Post:

http://www.denverpost.com/search/ci_9449135

Vail Daily:

http://www.vaildaily.com/article/20080608/EDITS/151034940

Aspen Times:

http://www.aspentimes.com/article/20080905/DAILYCOMMENT/809059990/1019&parentprofile=1061

Grand Junction Sentinel:

http://www.gjsentinel.com/opin/content/news/opinion/stories/2008/09/16/091708_6A_Amend48_edit.html

Pueblo Chieftain:

http://www.chieftain.com/articles/2008/09/20/editorial/doc48d49c3d08d34393576641.txt

Cortez Journal:

http://www.cortezjournal.com/main.asp?SectionID=5&SubSectionID=5&ArticleID=2106&TM=33762.87

Durango Herald:

http://www.durangoherald.com/asp-bin/article_generation.asp?article_type=opin&article_path=/opinion/opin080921_1.htm

Rocky Mountain News:

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/sep/22/vote-no-on-48/

Denver Post (2nd one):

http://www.denverpost.com/opinion/ci_10524970